NewJeans fans had a big role in Danielle leaving (1 Viewer)

[VillageIdiot]

I'd be more than welcome to picking their side if they actually put forward anything that substantially showed Hybe in a bad light but NewJeans just hasn't done that and it's shown by the fact they've lost almost every step of the way. I don't want to be seeing any big company being Hybe, SM or JYP as the good guy in a situation however between Min Heejin and Hybe it's easy to see based on evidence that Hybe is unfortunately the lesser of two evils.

*Smarter of the 2 evils, in no universe the lesser.

Newjeans should have played the game smarter and observed so Hybe wouldn't have been as careful. The only reason they lost is because of the label system, despite all of them being owned and controlled very closely by Hybe and being a blatant reflection of their interests.

I'm just not going to call a company whose labels are putting out videos calling teen girls 'the fantasies of adults", leak private training videos, bribe journalists to write thousands of negative articles about their own artists while burying financial crimes, mishandle a workplace harassment case by deleting damning footage and leaking the wrong one to make the victim look like a liar, and completely remove everyone responsible for NewJeans success in order to bench them "the lesser of two evils"

I understand the ruling but it just doesn't matter to me that Belift, source, tag etc are separate entities on paper. It's still Hybe at the end of the day

Those girls had every reason to fear for their careers and the sketchy way they handle the members coming back + Danielle's removal is proof of that. It was obvious with how they announced Hyein and Haerin coming back and framed it like the others just announced their return through the media without discussing with them that they were going to break up the team.

They went from mediaplaying Danielle signing other contracts (common sense would obviously say it never happened) to 'trying" to sign other contracts.

 

[Abeamus]

*Smarter of the 2 evils, in no universe the lesser.

Newjeans should have played the game smarter and observed so Hybe wouldn't have been as careful. The only reason they lost is because of the label system, despite all of them being owned and controlled very closely by Hybe and being a blatant reflection of their interests.

I'm just not going to call a company whose labels are putting out videos calling teen girls 'the fantasies of adults", leak private training videos, bribe journalists to write thousands of negative articles about their own artists while burying financial crimes, mishandle a workplace harassment case by deleting damning footage and leaking the wrong one to make the victim look like a liar, and completely remove everyone responsible for NewJeans success in order to bench them "the lesser of two evils"

I understand the ruling but it just doesn't matter to me that Belift, source, tag etc are separate entities on paper. It's still Hybe at the end of the day

Those girls had every reason to fear for their careers and the sketchy way they handle the members coming back + Danielle's removal is proof of that. It was obvious with how they announced Hyein and Haerin coming back and framed it like the others just announced their return through the media without discussing with them that they were going to break up the team.

They went from mediaplaying Danielle signing other contracts (common sense would obviously say it never happened) to 'trying" to sign other contracts.

You see the things you're mad at Hybe for are mostly things Min Heejin did she had them release Cookie and tell people that they were crazy for interpreting the lyrics as inappropriate for girls that young to sing. She spent money on a firm called McColl to run Team Bunnies and drive the narrative online about how evil Hybe is so people like you bought into it.

The leaking the trainee footage is also suspicious as Team Bunnies put documents out there that only Min Heejin would have been able to give them access to so was it really SouMu who leaked it or her side to manipulate the girls and parents even more as she would've had access to it as well. She's also the reason everyone left when she got kicked because they were loyal to her and benefitted from her which not everyone in fact did leave as the person in charge of Adors upcoming boy groups is one of the more important people in NewJeans success still under Ador.

The only thing you said that the judge talked about being a Hybe fault was that the ignore her incident might have happened however Hanni changed her story multiple times on that and the leaked Kakaotalks show Min Heejin telling her it was a big deal when initially she didn't think it was. Not to mention Hybe saying the members were fed lies over time for Hannis statement specifically which makes you wonder if she came back so easily because she realised people who were supposed to be looking out for her were lying to her like the member of Danielles family being sued for tampering.

The others did announce they were coming back without talking to Hybe though? They said in their statement Hybe isn't responding to them and it was clearly rushed based on the tone as they had intentions of appealing until apparently Hyeins dad talked Haerin and Hyein into agreeing to go back to Ador. As for Danielle all that needs to be true is that she was uncooperative for Hybe to have a reason to kick her out and in Hybes words they asked her to do something she refused to do it so they cut her because she would be breaking contract then regardless however let's say they're lying about the contract thing okay why hasn't she denied it?

I don't think for a second Hybe wanted to remove anyone from NewJeans as this makes their image harder to rehab and makes it harder for Hybe to make money off of them which is the only thing Hybe cares about but they have every right to if the terms of the contract are being ignored. Do I think the girls probably wanted Danielle still in the team? Sure but they need to look out for themselves and avoid their families being hit with the same debt Danielle is going to be since they aren't going to risk their financial stability just to keep the team and even to that end it would've been smarter to just leave at the end of their contract anyway since they have a negative image at the moment due to their own missteps.

 

[VillageIdiot]

I don't like Min Heejin at all but this is giving Reverse Flash villainy and extremely unrealistically biased.

You see the things you're mad at Hybe for are mostly things Min Heejin did she had them release Cookie and tell people that they were crazy for interpreting the lyrics as inappropriate for girls that young to sing.

Hybe is not in a much better position regarding exploitation, looking at all the times they had Eunchae and Yoonchae in short clothes throwing it back for their groups songs
Also: birds of a feather, they said themselves privately to Min Heejin they didn't agree with the Cookie controversy either. They are both shit.

She spent money on a firm called McColl to run Team Bunnies and drive the narrative online about how evil Hybe is so people like you bought into it.

As far as I know, McColl was only hired to put out her statements. Hybe has been suing random fans, youtube channels, and teambunnies trying to find a connection to Min. They've come up empty handed so far and the police might not even give team bunnies identity to Hybe at all.

Hybe straight up overspent millions of dollars on Tag PR. Even before all of this, it was well known as a smear campaign company linked to hate campaigns against multiple famous Hollywood stars and is quite literally in litigation with multiple other famous actresses for being a part of smear campaigns. Litigation that outright names Min Heejin as another potential victim as the digital footprint of the campaign against her matches perfectly with the campaigns Tag PR is accused to doing to women like Blake Lively, Amber Heard, Taylor Swift etc. So much so that the lawyers are offering to fly to Korea themselves to get Min Heejin in on the lawsuit.

Second of all, Hybe has a ridiculous control over the media. Over 10,000 negative articles have been written about MHJ and Newjeans. Journalists doggedly pursue those girls to the extent thet actively break restrictions placed on the media after Sulli and Hara and go out of their way to post pieces outside of the entertainment section on Naver because they want open comment sections and expose them to hate. All the while, they rarely and lightly touch hybe's misdeeds. A 16 year old girl is seen using her parents bank card and it was posted in the economy section. Many of the few pieces about Bang PD scamming early investors out of hundreds of millions of dollars are posted in the entertain section with closed comments. Hybe suffers a massive data break and compensates fans with a $10 weverse coupon: entertainment section. Hybe gets caught having 18,000 pages of defamatory content about the whole industry and journalists barely talked about it.

The leaking the trainee footage is also suspicious as Team Bunnies put documents out there that only Min Heejin would have been able to give them access to so was it really SouMu who leaked it or her side to manipulate the girls and parents even more as she would've had access to it as well.

First of all, there's a pretty big difference between leaking documents of a company's misdeeds to government officials and leaking videos of 13-16 year old girls twerking to tabloids

To recap: you are suggesting that Dispatch --who has been running pro hybe pieces since Day 1-- ran another pro-hybe piece that benefited Source Music and smeared MHJ, got statements from Source Music staff including Source Music's CEO and yet it was Min Heejin that gave them Source Music's trainee videos on a hit piece against her? I'm just gonna leave that one there because it's ridiculous

She's also the reason everyone left when she got kicked because they were loyal to her and benefitted from her which not everyone in fact did leave as the person in charge of Adors upcoming boy groups is one of the more important people in NewJeans success still under Ador.

She was just a graphic director but okay.
I would consider losing their executive producers, AR, business managers, music producers, stylists, choreographers etc a bigger loss. BANA was crucial to NewJeans's success as their exclusive producers and Hybe made it clear from the beginning they wanted them replaced.

The only thing you said that the judge talked about being a Hybe fault was that the ignore her incident might have happened however Hanni changed her story multiple times on that and the leaked Kakaotalks show Min Heejin telling her it was a big deal when initially she didn't think it was.

There's very little that changed with Hanni's story. The only difference being specific word choice "pass by and pretend you don't see her" vs "ignore her"
Other than that, her story was pretty consistent: the manager greeted her when she was with Danielle, and then told them to ignore her later on when she was by herself. That's what she told the public, and what she told Min Heejin when she privately reported it. Hybe leaked the wrong footage --the manager greeting her and Danielle, something she said numerous times did happen-- to "expose her" and frame her as a liar. In the later trials, they admitted that it wasn't actually the real footage and the incident had "somehow" been deleted. Hanni is not Korean or a native speaker, but she can tell what's being said even if she doesn't have perfect word choice recall.

Those texts also exposed Hybe for lying about why the footage was deleted. They said Hanni kept changing her story about when it happened so they weren't able to get the right footage but she clearly laid out there being 2 interactions from the start. Which begs the question on why they only had half the footage.

The others did announce they were coming back without talking to Hybe though? They said in their statement Hybe isn't responding to them and it was clearly rushed based on the tone as they had intentions of appealing until apparently Hyeins dad talked Haerin and Hyein into agreeing to go back to Ador.

This is not true and another example of mediaplay.
Hyein and Haerin did start negotiations a bit earlier than the older 3 but they did come around a few days later and all of them (with Hanni being repped by the others) were having meetings with the company. Ador made no mention of the others actively being in discussion at all, abruptly announced the younger 2 were coming back. The others obviously panicked at a clear attempt to cut them out and put out a statement and Ador responded by saying they would start discussions with the other 3 and "verify their sincerity," again failing to mention they had already been in discussion with them, which started a massive hate train against them and the media started putting out pieces calling for the other 3 to be removed for literally no reason.

All of this could have been avoided with a simple "We've confirmed Hyein and Haerin's return and are in active discussion with the other 3" or clarification after the fact. Ador never corrected it either.
The plan was always to split them up. Danielle has already stated she's not at liberty to speak on the matter, a lack of denial doesn't mean much

I don't think for a second Hybe wanted to remove anyone from NewJeans as this makes their image harder to rehab and makes it harder for Hybe to make money off of them which is the only thing Hybe cares about but they have every right to if the terms of the contract are being ignored.

People use this to excuse Hybe as a purely profit focused business and it's such a fallacy. Every business is run by people and emotions/hubris plays a factor often as much as "money driven machine" logic does. This is not new behavior, there have been countless examples of record labels sabotaging or undercutting their biggest acts over petty bullshit.

 

[Abeamus]

I don't like Min Heejin at all but this is giving Reverse Flash villainy and extremely unrealistically biased.


Hybe is not in a much better position regarding exploitation, looking at all the times they had Eunchae and Yoonchae in short clothes throwing it back for their groups songs
Also: birds of a feather, they said themselves privately to Min Heejin they didn't agree with the Cookie controversy either. They are both shit.


As far as I know, McColl was only hired to put out her statements. Hybe has been suing random fans, youtube channels, and teambunnies trying to find a connection to Min. They've come up empty handed so far and the police might not even give team bunnies identity to Hybe at all.

Hybe straight up overspent millions of dollars on Tag PR. Even before all of this, it was well known as a smear campaign company linked to hate campaigns against multiple famous Hollywood stars and is quite literally in litigation with multiple other famous actresses for being a part of smear campaigns. Litigation that outright names Min Heejin as another potential victim as the digital footprint of the campaign against her matches perfectly with the campaigns Tag PR is accused to doing to women like Blake Lively, Amber Heard, Taylor Swift etc. So much so that the lawyers are offering to fly to Korea themselves to get Min Heejin in on the lawsuit.

Second of all, Hybe has a ridiculous control over the media. Over 10,000 negative articles have been written about MHJ and Newjeans. Journalists doggedly pursue those girls to the extent thet actively break restrictions placed on the media after Sulli and Hara and go out of their way to post pieces outside of the entertainment section on Naver because they want open comment sections and expose them to hate. All the while, they rarely and lightly touch hybe's misdeeds. A 16 year old girl is seen using her parents bank card and it was posted in the economy section. Many of the few pieces about Bang PD scamming early investors out of hundreds of millions of dollars are posted in the entertain section with closed comments. Hybe suffers a massive data break and compensates fans with a $10 weverse coupon: entertainment section. Hybe gets caught having 18,000 pages of defamatory content about the whole industry and journalists barely talked about it.


First of all, there's a pretty big difference between leaking documents of a company's misdeeds to government officials and leaking videos of 13-16 year old girls twerking to tabloids

To recap: you are suggesting that Dispatch --who has been running pro hybe pieces since Day 1-- ran another pro-hybe piece that benefited Source Music and smeared MHJ, got statements from Source Music staff including Source Music's CEO and yet it was Min Heejin that gave them Source Music's trainee videos on a hit piece against her? I'm just gonna leave that one there because it's ridiculous

She was just a graphic director but okay.
I would consider losing their executive producers, AR, business managers, music producers, stylists, choreographers etc a bigger loss. BANA was crucial to NewJeans's success as their exclusive producers and Hybe made it clear from the beginning they wanted them replaced.

There's very little that changed with Hanni's story. The only difference being specific word choice "pass by and pretend you don't see her" vs "ignore her"
Other than that, her story was pretty consistent: the manager greeted her when she was with Danielle, and then told them to ignore her later on when she was by herself. That's what she told the public, and what she told Min Heejin when she privately reported it. Hybe leaked the wrong footage --the manager greeting her and Danielle, something she said numerous times did happen-- to "expose her" and frame her as a liar. In the later trials, they admitted that it wasn't actually the real footage and the incident had "somehow" been deleted. Hanni is not Korean or a native speaker, but she can tell what's being said even if she doesn't have perfect word choice recall.

Those texts also exposed Hybe for lying about why the footage was deleted. They said Hanni kept changing her story about when it happened so they weren't able to get the right footage but she clearly laid out there being 2 interactions from the start. Which begs the question on why they only had half the footage.

This is not true and another example of mediaplay.
Hyein and Haerin did start negotiations a bit earlier than the older 3 but they did come around a few days later and all of them (with Hanni being repped by the others) were having meetings with the company. Ador made no mention of the others actively being in discussion at all, abruptly announced the younger 2 were coming back. The others obviously panicked at a clear attempt to cut them out and put out a statement and Ador responded by saying they would start discussions with the other 3 and "verify their sincerity," again failing to mention they had already been in discussion with them, which started a massive hate train against them and the media started putting out pieces calling for the other 3 to be removed for literally no reason.

All of this could have been avoided with a simple "We've confirmed Hyein and Haerin's return and are in active discussion with the other 3" or clarification after the fact. Ador never corrected it either.
The plan was always to split them up. Danielle has already stated she's not at liberty to speak on the matter, a lack of denial doesn't mean much

People use this to excuse Hybe as a purely profit focused business and it's such a fallacy. Every business is run by people and emotions/hubris plays a factor often as much as "money driven machine" logic does. This is not new behavior, there have been countless examples of record labels sabotaging or undercutting their biggest acts over petty bullshit.

Yeah they both exploit minors in some way as the industry does as a whole but when it comes to NewJeans specifically we have no idea how Hybe would promote them simply as they refused to listen the moment Min Heejin was out the door so I'm not going to get pre-emptively mad at something for NewJeans that just hasn't happened yet.

Fans and YouTube channels usually only get sued if they are consistenly defaming a group maliciously so if they are then that's on them as I certainly won't defend people putting negativity into the world. TeamBunnies went from a team of professionals to only being a minor so care to explain why a minor would organize donations which scammed fans and talk to lawyers on behalf of the girls if they are just a minor with no power?

Yeah companies do engage in PR because it works like the sentiment around this discussion was very pro NewJeans initially with Hybe being buried themselves usually until the injunction and some of NewJeans comments themselves got the sentiment turned around to be anti NewJeans which because that became the sentiment meant there started being a wave of articles against NewJeans for clicks and I would not doubt Hybe put a few select pieces out there to stir the pot but it's far from controlling the media.

Yes and I spoke about the WeVerse issue and said it's ran poorly but you seem to be mixing up my lack of support for NewJeans as support for Hybe which isn't the case I just haven't been given a reason by NewJeans to believe they have suffered this great mistreatment compared to idols like Loona who were gaining debt for performing so I'm capable of thinking Hybe is a bad company while also believing NewJeans had no chance of winning the case out the gate and would be foolish to see it through.

The video didn't benefit Source though? All the discussion I saw around it was as a "how could Hybe do this" since people saw it as a hit piece so it got linked to Hybe which it's possible Hybe did it thinking it was an ingenius idea turning out to fumble in their usual fashion but Dispatch is just paid media all the same like how they covered Sugas drunk driving incident so they can cover Hybe pieces if it will get clicks.

You can't say someone was crucial to NewJeans success if we have not seen how they are without them and from Pit Stop alone when they had those kinds of people still I'd say Hybes money helped more as that song was not great.

Security footage isn't kept permanently which they pulled the footage they thought was what Hanni was referring to and by the time she talked about it being the wrong incident the rest was deleted because the time they kept it expired. My opinion on the matter is even if it did happen so what? It's a manager from a different sub-label who they created tension with the plagiarism accusations and even as a random isolated incident it does not warrant mistreament unless they spoke to someone above and more incidents still happened with no intervention which at the time would have been Min Heejin anyway.

Hybe had one meeting with the full group minus Hanni while they had already had multiple meetings with Hyein and Haerin but had Minji and Danielle been serious about returning they would have been back since Hanni only had 1 meeting from what I can tell with her parents being there and she was back just like that meanwhile Danielle is out and Minji is still being waited on.

Danielle can't get into details about the case itself there is nothing stopping her from denying the article Hybe put out about her signing other contracts since that's public information but we'll see what happens when that case gets going.

The most damage NewJeans have suffered has been self inflicted in my eyes but at the end of the day I'm more focused on the girls careers than I am some vehement hatred of Hybe as I can not like Hybe as a company but it's irrelevant to the fact NewJeans were always going to lose that case as shown by every single point of theirs being thrown out and even with extra time they had nothing so going against Hybe at this point only serves to further throw away their financial stability and a real fan of NewJeans would be able to recognize it the same way that I can dislike that Gfriend had to work with Hybe for their 10th anniversary however I understand how much releasing something for their 10th anniversary meant to them so as long as they are happy I'll be content about the decision as well barring anything else happening.

 

[VillageIdiot]

Fans and YouTube channels usually only get sued if they are consistenly defaming a group maliciously so if they are then that's on them as I certainly won't defend people putting negativity into the world.

Hybe has been suing people for criticizing the company and lying to say it was about defaming groups.
Which is why they've lost so many cases and they know that, it's about silencing the critics.

Funny enough, they tried to sue fans that said Hybe was manipulating the media. They lost

Yeah companies do engage in PR because it works like the sentiment around this discussion was very pro NewJeans initially with Hybe being buried themselves usually until the injunction and some of NewJeans comments themselves got the sentiment turned around to be anti NewJeans which because that became the sentiment meant there started being a wave of articles against NewJeans for clicks and I would not doubt Hybe put a few select pieces out there to stir the pot but it's far from controlling the media.

All companies engage in pr. Not all companies are taking journalists to expensive hotels and golfing trips, spending millions of dollars in defamatory yellow journalism and are somehow immune to criticism even when they're accused of billions of dollars worth of fraud.
Again, this is just wrong. Journalists were attacking NewJeans from the very beginning, long before the sentiment around them changed.

he video didn't benefit Source though? All the discussion I saw around it was as a "how could Hybe do this" since people saw it as a hit piece so it got linked to Hybe which it's possible Hybe did it thinking it was an ingenius idea turning out to fumble in their usual fashion but Dispatch is just paid media all the same like how they covered Sugas drunk driving incident so they can cover Hybe pieces if it will get clicks.

The videos were a part of a pro-source music article. With interviews from source staff. And their CEO. And all the materials later being used by source in their lawsuit. It doesn't matter if they fumbled it, that's what the intention was

You can't say someone was crucial to NewJeans success if we have not seen how they are without them and from Pit Stop alone when they had those kinds of people still I'd say Hybes money helped more as that song was not great

Pitstop was made by the exact same people that made all of NewJeans music. I don't know what difference you think Hybe's money is going to have on it or why you think some graphic designer matters more than the producers that are absolutely responsible for a huge chunk of their success

Security footage isn't kept permanently which they pulled the footage they thought was what Hanni was referring to and by the time she talked about it being the wrong incident the rest was deleted because the time they kept it expired. My opinion on the matter is even if it did happen so what? It's a manager from a different sub-label who they created tension with the plagiarism accusations and even as a random isolated incident it does not warrant mistreament unless they spoke to someone above and more incidents still happened with no intervention which at the time would have been Min Heejin anyway.

1. Like I said, Hybe themselves showed Hanni reporting the incident the same way she'd been telling. Therefore, there's no excuse to not have it.
2. I don't care if you think they deserve it just for being under the same label. It's not okay. And it's mot just an isolated incident if you have so many layers of management working to cover it up instead of just issuing out a simple warning.

A rude manager is one thing. The head of HR, the security team, a different sublabel and then their own sublabel working so hard to cover up something so small and lie on Hanni is a pretty glaring issue

And I like how you just ignored them knowingly leaking the wrong footage to hurt Hanni.

Hybe had one meeting with the full group minus Hanni while they had already had multiple meetings with Hyein and Haerin but had Minji and Danielle been serious about returning they would have been back since Hanni only had 1 meeting from what I can tell with her parents being there and she was back just like that meanwhile Danielle is out and Minji is still being waited on.

Interesting backtracking.

Danielle can't get into details about the case itself there is nothing stopping her from denying the article Hybe put out about her signing other contracts since that's public information

Is that not a detail of the case?

real fan of NewJeans would be able to recognize it

 

[Abeamus]

Hybe has been suing people for criticizing the company and lying to say it was about defaming groups.
Which is why they've lost so many cases and they know that, it's about silencing the critics.

Funny enough, they tried to sue fans that said Hybe was manipulating the media. They lost


All companies engage in pr. Not all companies are taking journalists to expensive hotels and golfing trips, spending millions of dollars in defamatory yellow journalism and are somehow immune to criticism even when they're accused of billions of dollars worth of fraud.
Again, this is just wrong. Journalists were attacking NewJeans from the very beginning, long before the sentiment around them changed.

The videos were a part of a pro-source music article. With interviews from source staff. And their CEO. And all the materials later being used by source in their lawsuit. It doesn't matter if they fumbled it, that's what the intention was



Pitstop was made by the exact same people that made all of NewJeans music. I don't know what difference you think Hybe's money is going to have on it or why you think some graphic designer matters more than the producers that are absolutely responsible for a huge chunk of their success



1. Like I said, Hybe themselves showed Hanni reporting the incident the same way she'd been telling. Therefore, there's no excuse to not have it.
2. I don't care if you think they deserve it just for being under the same label. It's not okay. And it's mot just an isolated incident if you have so many layers of management working to cover it up instead of just issuing out a simple warning.

A rude manager is one thing. The head of HR, the security team, a different sublabel and then their own sublabel working so hard to cover up something so small and lie on Hanni is a pretty glaring issue

And I like how you just ignored them knowingly leaking the wrong footage to hurt Hanni.


Interesting backtracking.

Is that not a detail of the case?

The attacking Newjeans part from the beginning is sure there were some but sentiment changing matters like anything with a lot of eyes on it is going to get negativity around it which as for whether Hybe is in bed with journalists I don't see how it's relevant to the topic when as you said everyone engages in PR in some way the method does not matter if it's deemed something they shouldn't be doing regardless which cases can be a part of this while ultimately being up to the court to deem if their is sufficient evidence of intent.

You believe it was purely Hybe from the leak and as far as I am aware there is no real evidence of who leaked them so we'll have to agree to disagree.

Pitstop did have all that and people generally agreed it was lackluster and forgettable so there are no "key" people to NewJeans success other than the girls themselves as everyone else can be replaced as long as the end product works for NewJeans to perform it well while leaving a good impression on people.

They said the rest was auto deleted so just depends on if you believe them and who said I think they deserve it? It's just understandable that there would be tension but for the focus on the point you are assured it was a cover up and not just a misunderstanding which is where I cannot prove it was not so you're free to think as you wish since even the judge couldn't clearly rule on that incident which is why I didn't acknowledge the wrong footage as I have no idea how that conversation went down to acknowledge if it truly is.

What backtracking? Hybe had 1 meeting with Minji and Danielle before the HH announcement was made which was the full group meeting then they started individual meetings after the HH announcement and apart from Hanni having flown in specifically to do her meeting with her parents there isn't much information on Danielle or Minjis individual meetings which given Danielle and Minji had more time than the others while still not coming to a concrete agreement it does make you wonder exactly what they were asking for.

Public and private details are two different things since to use something as evidence you don't want to give away too much as it can mess with your case but Hybe already made that detail public so it's okay for her to refute it like their side have done in the past with things since a simple this is false will not hurt her case if she can prove it is indeed false in court without giving too much away in terms of proving why it's false since that could hurt her evidence.

You can side eye it if you want but you seem more concerned about Hybe being punished even if it means the members themselves are in financial debt for a long time just to spite Hybe which I personally can't understand as for me that just seems like a terrible outcome if it was one of my groups.

 

[VillageIdiot]

The attacking Newjeans part from the beginning is sure there were some but sentiment changing matters like anything with a lot of eyes on it is going to get negativity around it which as for whether Hybe is in bed with journalists I don't see how it's relevant to the topic when as you said everyone engages in PR in some way the method does not matter if it's deemed something they shouldn't be doing regardless which cases can be a part of this while ultimately being up to the court to deem if their is sufficient evidence of intent.

You believe it was purely Hybe from the leak and as far as I am aware there is no real evidence of who leaked them so we'll have to agree to disagree.

Pitstop did have all that and people generally agreed it was lackluster and forgettable so there are no "key" people to NewJeans success other than the girls themselves as everyone else can be replaced as long as the end product works for NewJeans to perform it well while leaving a good impression on people.

They said the rest was auto deleted so just depends on if you believe them and who said I think they deserve it? It's just understandable that there would be tension but for the focus on the point you are assured it was a cover up and not just a misunderstanding which is where I cannot prove it was not so you're free to think as you wish since even the judge couldn't clearly rule on that incident which is why I didn't acknowledge the wrong footage as I have no idea how that conversation went down to acknowledge if it truly is.

What backtracking? Hybe had 1 meeting with Minji and Danielle before the HH announcement was made which was the full group meeting then they started individual meetings after the HH announcement and apart from Hanni having flown in specifically to do her meeting with her parents there isn't much information on Danielle or Minjis individual meetings which given Danielle and Minji had more time than the others while still not coming to a concrete agreement it does make you wonder exactly what they were asking for.

Public and private details are two different things since to use something as evidence you don't want to give away too much as it can mess with your case but Hybe already made that detail public so it's okay for her to refute it like their side have done in the past with things since a simple this is false will not hurt her case if she can prove it is indeed false in court without giving too much away in terms of proving why it's false since that could hurt her evidence.

You can side eye it if you want but you seem more concerned about Hybe being punished even if it means the members themselves are in financial debt for a long time just to spite Hybe which I personally can't understand as for me that just seems like a terrible outcome if it was one of my groups.

You seem to require a lot to believe Hybe is responsible for anything and almost nothing to believe NewJeans or MHJ is responsible for everything.

And while I don't want NewJeans in financial debt, I also don't want them silenced and miserable in a shitty company that's been nothing but harmfully for them since the start of the conflict, so I just don't see why I should feel the need to make excuses or defenses for everything Hybe does in order to be a "real fan"

 

[Abeamus]

You seem to require a lot to believe Hybe is responsible for anything and almost nothing to believe NewJeans or MHJ is responsible for everything.

And while I don't want NewJeans in financial debt, I also don't want them silenced and miserable in a shitty company that's been nothing but harmfully for them since the start of the conflict, so I just don't see why I should feel the need to make excuses or defenses for everything Hybe does in order to be a "real fan"

Most of what Hybe has done has been in response to stuff Min Heejin has done so far with NewJeans being under Hybe without Min Heejin for like 2 weeks so personally I'd like to see how NewJeans is under Hybe and if they don't do well at that point then that's entirely on Hybe and I'm more than willing to look like a clown if all of Bunnies fears come true however I just don't see it happening.

No one is asking you to cheer because they are under Hybe like you don't see me cheering that Gfriend is under Hybe but there's a big difference between begrudgingly being okay with it as long as your favourites end up being treated well and pre-emptively deciding that you know how something is going to go before it's even happened. Just yesterday that letter from Danielle came out dated the day the return announcements were made and it reads that she didn't have the same intentions as the others even then so maybe she knew what the outcome would be and got terminated intentionally which I hope it works out for her but I do not see it going the way she envisions and we'll see what else comes out about this whole mess.

 

[VillageIdiot]

Just yesterday that letter from Danielle came out dated the day the return announcements were made and it reads that she didn't have the same intentions as the others even then so maybe she knew what the outcome would be and got terminated intentionally which I hope it works out for her but I do not see it going the way she envisions and we'll see what else comes out about this whole mess.

The letter was written the same day Ador went forward with announcing Hyein and Haerin's return without any mention that the others were still in discussions. Which, like I just painstakingly explained, made it obvious they were always going to cut the other 3 out.

No one is asking you to cheer because they are under Hybe like you don't see me cheering that Gfriend is under Hybe but there's a big difference between begrudgingly being okay with it as long as your favourites end up being treated well and pre-emptively deciding that you know how something is going to go before it's even happened.

You're pretty much telling me not to criticize them at all or else I'd rather NewJeans ends up in a lifetime of debt. That's insane and the definition of a fallacy
I'm not even criticizing things that haven't happened yet, I'm criticizing them for things that they did

 

[sooya_]

damn, that is very bad

 

[Abeamus]

The letter was written the same day Ador went forward with announcing Hyein and Haerin's return without any mention that the others were still in discussions. Which, like I just painstakingly explained, made it obvious they were always going to cut the other 3 out.


You're pretty much telling me not to criticize them at all or else I'd rather NewJeans ends up in a lifetime of debt. That's insane and the definition of a fallacy
I'm not even criticizing things that haven't happened yet, I'm criticizing them for things that they did

Sorry but your first point is delusional considering Danielle mentions NewJeans as a whole except for her and considering Ador saying she got cut for not complying then her letter would line up with that if she really didn't want to go back in the first place. As for telling you not to criticize them at all that's just a false claim you're making entirely since I even say don't get mad about things that haven't happened yet which makes it perfectly reasonable to get mad when those things you are concerned about seem reasonable.

If you want to hang on and focus on the things Hybe have done to NewJeans that are shady at least you are free too but it's not going to change anything now unless Danielle can argue them better against her penalties and your energy would do much better waiting to see what Hybe does and getting mad there if it turns out to be as bad as you think it will since you're only supposed to learn from the past not live in it.

 

[HugeBakkaeMotae]

damn, that is very bad

Not to derail the thread but this made me laugh out loud. I'm just reading these essay arguments and all of a sudden the most simplistic reply possible.

 

[Selfmate]

Not to derail the thread but this made me laugh out loud. I'm just reading these essay arguments and all of a sudden the most simplistic reply possible.

we have an entire megathread if you're interested lol

Hybe/MHJ Civil War Megathread - K-Pop Source: The Ultimate K-Pop Fan Community

 

[sooya_]

Not to derail the thread but this made me laugh out loud. I'm just reading these essay arguments and all of a sudden the most simplistic reply possible.

well, like to keep it simple, especially in tough times

 

[VillageIdiot]

Sorry but your first point is delusional considering Danielle mentions NewJeans as a whole except for her

How is it delusional when she mentions them all individually and says she'll love them all no matter what happens?
Minji, Danielle and Hanni all got the same law firm to negotiate with Ador and all 3 got left out. Her letter makes it pretty clear she doesn't know what's going on either and the fact that she named the others individually instead of the group makes it clear she didn't think she was the only one getting cut

Ador saying she got cut for not complying then her letter would line up with that if she really didn't want to go back in the first place.

Ah yes, Danielle who completely switched law firms to return, negotiated privately, went public to stop Ador from cutting her and then spent another 2 months negotiating her return never wanted to come back because Ador, the company that made it clear they were going to break up the team from the beginning, said so.

As for telling you not to criticize them at all that's just a false claim you're making entirely since I even say don't get mad about things that haven't happened yet which makes it perfectly reasonable to get mad when those things you are concerned about seem reasonable.

Then why are you complaining and deflecting at the end of every post about how I shouldn't be criticizing Hybe

at the end of the day I'm more focused on the girls careers than I am some vehement hatred of Hybe as I can not like Hybe as a company but it's irrelevant to the fact NewJeans were always going to lose that case as shown by every single point of theirs being thrown out and even with extra time they had nothing so going against Hybe at this point only serves to further throw away their financial stability and a real fan of NewJeans would be able to recognize it

ou can side eye it if you want but you seem more concerned about Hybe being punished even if it means the members themselves are in financial debt for a long time just to spite Hybe which I personally can't understand as for me that just seems like a terrible outcome if it was one of my groups.

Including this post

If you want to hang on and focus on the things Hybe have done to NewJeans that are shady at least you are free too but it's not going to change anything now unless Danielle can argue them better against her penalties and your energy would do much better waiting to see what Hybe does and getting mad there if it turns out to be as bad as you think it will since you're only supposed to learn from the past not live in it.