Sensitive Do you think idols should speak about politics or humanitarean issues? (1 Viewer)

[Selfmate]

That's correct. No one forces the idols to sign or renew their contracts. They just give up a part of their freedom they'll possibly never miss.

Within the legal framework we have Freedom Of Speech in Germany (theoretically). But what percentage of the German artists really use this freedom? Most German musicians write songs about everyday topics anyway. Most people love there comfort zones, and they don't want to leave them - not even musically.

but we can extend it even further my friend - what of actual freedoms that they might actually miss - say freedom to "date" or have relationships - I'm obviously aware of the unwritten rules with regards to dating and kpop but what if a company made it explicit in writing within a contract say "no dating with the first two years of debut"

surely that's curtailing a freedom that they would actually miss but what if an idol gets caught doing that? I don't necessarily agree with a company stipulating that term but if the idol understood and agreed to it???

that's true but even within such freedoms one still has to look out for no. 1 (ie. themselves lol) - it's always a balancing act no matter if you're a kpop idol vs western singer or german musician - there's lots of things that one might want to speak out against/for etc etc but even I as a normal non celebrity knows that certain things will (not if) will get taken out of context by certain people who will disagree vehemently with what I said and if those people are my customers/employer/general public??? then I might make a common sense/rational/ self interested decision to not say the thing at all

 

[Ahsoka]

I think there’s a time and a place for politics. Like for example, when an idol went on a rant about how the media was full of propaganda and that the country in question was a good place in the middle of a concert I was like for more than one reason. There’s also cases where most likely the idols were forced into making political posts (Chinese idols). So even when they do have political views it’s sometimes hard to tell if it’s their views or not. But overall I think it’s better if they just stay away from politics for the same of their career, no matter what views they share someone will disagree. Sure they might get people annoyed at them for not sharing their views but sharing views it’s definitely going to piss off a lot of people. Obviously if they really want to I’m not going to be annoyed at them (unless their views are ridiculous) because freedom of speech, I just think it’s smarter not to share them for their own sakes.

 

[PloryWinxyMYBlnk]

No, because they'll get more backlash than they already do. You all know this is true.

Also, labels won't go for that either. They'd rather have artists stay focused on making music and promotions.

Personally, I'd prefer them not to have additional stresses, worries, and pressures invading their lives.

 

[chiefchilly1]

Bruh there’s like a disaster a day in this world no way people are wanting idols to speak on everything

 

[Wingfrost]

I don’t really have an opinion about this topic to be honest.

 

[Moguri]

then that's a choice they make when entering such a contract within the stipulations of being a kpop idol
you mentioned kpop norms and I'll add korean culture as well -the CJK countries are known for their collectivism as oppose to their individualism so the idols just choose not to do or say certain things...

then the question becomes what is "freedom"??? let's say one is bound by a contractual term in a contract to not speak about certain issues - sure that's limiting the freedom but that's a choice one makes when entering such a contract no?

I think while you are in theory right, I do not like that you completely ignore the circumstances those contracts are usually made under. Meaning hopefull youth that get the opportunity to follow their dreams, willing to sign their innocent little souls away, as they simply do not know it better yet. I remember Chuus statement when she explained how she signed her contract with blockberry, saying she did not understand anything that was written how the profit split works nor did she care, as she was just so happy to start her career as an Idol..

Ofc one can say its their own fault, but I think either the parents or the korean society in itself really fails the young people here and sets them up to be abused by evil corporations for many years..

I guess that was a bit besides the original point now, but it really bothers me that you emphasize so much how much of a choice the idols made

 

[Selfmate]

I think while you are in theory right, I do not like that you completely ignore the circumstances those contracts are usually made under. Meaning hopefull youth that get the opportunity to follow their dreams, willing to sign their innocent little souls away, as they simply do not know it better yet. I remember Chuus statement when she explained how she signed her contract with blockberry, saying she did not understand anything that was written how the profit split works nor did she care, as she was just so happy to start her career as an Idol..

Ofc one can say its their own fault, but I think either the parents or the korean society in itself really fails the young people here and sets them up to be abused by evil corporations for many years..

I guess that was a bit besides the original point now, but it really bothers me that you emphasize so much how much of a choice the idols made

everybody has a choice - they have a choice to not enter such contracts, whenever anybody in real life enters into any kind of contract - they can be as small as buy a chocolate bar - that's still a contract up to and including buying a house/employment contracts etc etc

all those things one has to understand the ramifications of entering into them - sure the chocolate contract is min risk and thus we barely even give it a second thought but what of the others??? who bears the onus of protecting the parties to the contract - obviously themselves - each person to a contract seeks to protect their interests first and foremost - anybody that thinks otherwise is just naive

and for those larger contracts the law stipulates that (consenting competent) adults bear the responsibility for understanding it - you can't enter a contract then claim oops I didn't understand it and if one doesn't understand it one has to get legal advice - it's why lawyers make shit tonnes of money lol

getting back to kpop contracts - I've always said I have nothing against unfair terms in such contracts as long as one is made aware of such - if you enter it without reading/understanding it that's on you for not getting proper legal advice - you bear the risk of not understanding it or in terms of minors your parents do since they are responsible for signing the thing on your behalf (again this is absent any form of malfeasance or abuse on the part of the parent)

and why is unfair because that's how the system works!!!! every single INITIAL recording contract in the entire history of the word is slanted towards the company cos they have the power...unless you blow up big and become the next beiber/swift/twice/bp/bts etc etc I'm pretty sure one starts at the bottom with terms more favourable to the company and only once you blow up big and command the power to terminate/renegotiate the contract does it begin to work in your favour...it's how the industry works whether it's kpop or otherwise

it's no different from employment contracts with non-celebrity people for normal non-nepotism people we all start at the bottom with contracts that are more favourable to the company and only by getting more experience proving our worth do we then have a semblence of power to negotiate more favourable terms and $$$

the only thing I'll add is that I want more transparency within kpop contracts - that is sure make it as unfair as the company wants but disclose it - if you are introducing trainee debt then make sure you give proper monthly/weekly etc accounts of the revenue/expenses/profit to the artist

 

[Chilly]

I think if they actually care about it yes

 

[Moguri]

everybody has a choice - they have a choice to not enter such contracts, whenever anybody in real life enters into any kind of contract - they can be as small as buy a chocolate bar - that's still a contract up to and including buying a house/employment contracts etc etc

all those things one has to understand the ramifications of entering into them - sure the chocolate contract is min risk and thus we barely even give it a second thought but what of the others??? who bears the onus of protecting the parties to the contract - obviously themselves - each person to a contract seeks to protect their interests first and foremost - anybody that thinks otherwise is just naive

and for those larger contracts the law stipulates that (consenting competent) adults bear the responsibility for understanding it - you can't enter a contract then claim oops I didn't understand it and if one doesn't understand it one has to get legal advice - it's why lawyers make shit tonnes of money lol

getting back to kpop contracts - I've always said I have nothing against unfair terms in such contracts as long as one is made aware of such - if you enter it without reading/understanding it that's on you for not getting proper legal advice - you bear the risk of not understanding it or in terms of minors your parents do since they are responsible for signing the thing on your behalf (again this is absent any form of malfeasance or abuse on the part of the parent)

and why is unfair because that's how the system works!!!! every single INITIAL recording contract in the entire history of the word is slanted towards the company cos they have the power...unless you blow up big and become the next beiber/swift/twice/bp/bts etc etc I'm pretty sure one starts at the bottom with terms more favourable to the company and only once you blow up big and command the power to terminate/renegotiate the contract does it begin to work in your favour...it's how the industry works whether it's kpop or otherwise

it's no different from employment contracts with non-celebrity people for normal non-nepotism people we all start at the bottom with contracts that are more favourable to the company and only by getting more experience proving our worth do we then have a semblence of power to negotiate more favourable terms and $$$

the only thing I'll add is that I want more transparency within kpop contracts - that is sure make it as unfair as the company wants but disclose it - if you are introducing trainee debt then make sure you give proper monthly/weekly etc accounts of the revenue/expenses/profit to the artist

Contracts that favor one party to the extent some of the Kpop contracts do should be flat out illegal and the companies issuing them should be held accountable and punished by the law. Sadly the jurisdiction of most countries is too deep down the corporations asses and lets them get away with a complete lack of ethics and responsibility

 

[Selfmate]

Contracts that favor one party to the extent some of the Kpop contracts do should be flat out illegal and the companies issuing them should be held accountable and punished by the law. Sadly the jurisdiction of most countries is too deep down the corporations asses and lets them get away with a complete lack of ethics and responsibility

shoulda coulda woulda my friend
if only things in this world would be "fairer" but they aren't so one has to deal with it as best and one can...
there are a lot of things that should be illegal but aren't - what can you or I or any single kpop idol do about it? at the end of the day lawyer up and cover one's own ass!!!

 

[Moguri]

shoulda coulda woulda my friend
if only things in this world would be "fairer" but they aren't so one has to deal with it as best and one can...
there are a lot of things that should be illegal but aren't - what can you or I or any single kpop idol do about it? at the end of the day lawyer up and cover one's own ass!!!

I do not disagree with you, that there is realisticly not too much we can do about it

But at least we do not have to act like it is a good thing

 

[Selfmate]

I do not disagree with you, that there is realisticly not too much we can do about it

But at least we do not have to act like it is a good thing

I never said it was a good thing merely that one (either you or I or a kpop idol) should do their best to protect one's own interests but I also didn't say it was a bd thing either - it's something for the parties to agree on themselves...

 

[seungfloral]

I agree with pretty much everything else said here so far. If they do, and they want to and their company allows it, I suppose it’s fine, but I use K-Pop almost as a form of escapism, and hearing about politics reminds me of reality too much and how messed up the world can be. Plus, there’s a lot of nuance to a lot of political matters, even in cases when it seems pretty straightforward, and I’d be worried about the idols either unintentionally miswording something without realizing it. Also, we all know how bad fanwars are. Imagine if immature fans took seriously issues that affected countless people every day and used them in fanwars? I don’t know, I feel like that would boil my blood so much, and the worst part is that I can sadly imagine something like that happening if idols become more open about their beliefs. Long story short, I’m fine if they do it, but there’s going to be consequences of doing so and not all of them are going to be good.

Yeah i agree, kpop is my escapism too. I'm probably escaping 90% of life tbh. And some idols political views might also differ from their fans'. Imagine that fanwar 👀

This is a bit smaller scale, but I think of the en members saying something dumb or something that comes off as ignorant (I think one of them got in trouble for saying "Korean history is short and that's why he likes world history better" recently, and like, are these kids being malicious? no. I think they are young and maybe not the best at expressing or say things without thinking.

But nonetheless, people have understandable reasons for criticizing things like that so like.. idk stepping back, thinking before you speak, or keeping some things off camera can honestly go a long way.

I also think the enhypen thing was mostly ignorance than malice. Ofc it's criticized, cause koreans have achieved their idependence from Japan and went through a war less than a century ago, so the wounds are still fresh probably. But i think the members can educate themselves and ppl should take into consideration that they are young and still in their forming years.
But yeah, keeping smth scrapped and edited is better then hearing it back again and again and being criticized for a mistake.

they shouldn't have to but if they want to at least amplify the voices of those who are more educated on a certain issue than they are, they should be allowed to do that without being forced to stay apolitical. with that being said, people shouldn't use celebrities as a moral guidance and celebrity activism seems very performative sometimes so i'd rather have them do something quietly than act like jaejoong who lied about having covid to "spread awareness" or that boy group who used george floyd's last words as a sample in their song.

Of course they can, they should be free , but i also think the company keeps them in reigns in case smth happens, ex. The likes with enha above. And ofc u cant be totally right or totally wrong in politics, imo. Cause while the political teachings that u follow might be good, but the ppl preaching it arent perfect and would just disillusion you.

Wait JAEJOONG DID WHAT? WHICH GROUP USED WHAT? am i in dreamland? Is this true?

 

[seungfloral]

they will get criticized either way so it's up to them to decide if they want to do it or not

Thats true, Damned if u do, damned if u dont

Since environmental pollution is a humanitarean issue, my ult group already did.

That's a good issue where they could speak up.

Idols give up that freedom, together with many others, when they sign their contracts

That's also true. They could , but the consequences could ruin their whole careers or even lives. I wouldnt wish that on anyone.

(Hi this is ur message from the past xD)

 

[Myth]

I also think the enhypen thing was mostly ignorance than malice. Ofc it's criticized, cause koreans have achieved their idependence from Japan and went through a war less than a century ago, so the wounds are still fresh probably. But i think the members can educate themselves and ppl should take into consideration that they are young and still in their forming years.
But yeah, keeping smth scrapped and edited is better then hearing it back again and again and being criticized for a mistake.

yeah I don't think you're wrong about that, unfortunately that won't happen. Netizens are harsh and the online age has unfortunately amplified that more since people can make brutal and mean comments with the veil of anonymity... ofc this will always happen regardless of if you're in a controversy bc that's just how it is, but controversy amplifies this more. That's kind of why I stress being contentious of what you say and your digital footprint a bit more, I think that's easier to control than anticipating their reactions.

In an ideal world, people would be more measured and wouldn't be quick to assume things without all the facts however. I wish it was like that.

 

[seungfloral]

but we can extend it even further my friend - what of actual freedoms that they might actually miss - say freedom to "date" or have relationships - I'm obviously aware of the unwritten rules with regards to dating and kpop but what if a company made it explicit in writing within a contract say "no dating with the first two years of debut"

surely that's curtailing a freedom that they would actually miss but what if an idol gets caught doing that? I don't necessarily agree with a company stipulating that term but if the idol understood and agreed to it???

that's true but even within such freedoms one still has to look out for no. 1 (ie. themselves lol) - it's always a balancing act no matter if you're a kpop idol vs western singer or german musician - there's lots of things that one might want to speak out against/for etc etc but even I as a normal non celebrity knows that certain things will (not if) will get taken out of context by certain people who will disagree vehemently with what I said and if those people are my customers/employer/general public??? then I might make a common sense/rational/ self interested decision to not say the thing at all

I think there’s a time and a place for politics. Like for example, when an idol went on a rant about how the media was full of propaganda and that the country in question was a good place in the middle of a concert I was like for more than one reason. There’s also cases where most likely the idols were forced into making political posts (Chinese idols).

Ohhh the shade, but yeah, there are always a place and time too. Thats an important factor!

No, because they'll get more backlash than they already do. You all know this is true.

Yeah, the companies only want their money invested back, ofc they dont want their idol to blabber about controversial topics cause it can backfire.

Bruh there’s like a disaster a day in this world no way people are wanting idols to speak on everything

Oh ... If you only knew. Recently during the Turkey-Syria disaster a lot of fans demanded Chan to speak up about it in his live, which u know would be a great gesture, but then there would maybe be backlash like "why didnt he talk about other disasters before?" And after that it was revealed that some members donated for relief efforts.
So yeah, there are ppl who demand visible action...

 

[seungfloral]

In an ideal world, people would be more measured and wouldn't be quick to assume things without all the facts however. I wish it was like that.

Yeah, sadly people are rather quick to judge and less so to forgive or to measure things as u said.

Lastly i wanna say that i do agree with most comments. I'm not gonna adress the contract discussion since this isn't the main topic of the thread.

Main point is , idols are free to speak out most of the time, (except when their companies prohibit it) but i won't fault them if measuring the consequences they decide not to. We shouldnt judge them either if they decide to remain silent, since they are artists who signed up to entertain people and not to divide them by political views.

 

[eclipsoul]

Of course they can, they should be free , but i also think the company keeps them in reigns in case smth happens, ex. The likes with enha above. And ofc u cant be totally right or totally wrong in politics, imo. Cause while the political teachings that u follow might be good, but the ppl preaching it arent perfect and would just disillusion you.

Wait JAEJOONG DID WHAT? WHICH GROUP USED WHAT? am i in dreamland? Is this true?

yeah it's true, 2020 was wild....

Update: JYJ's Kim Jaejoong Clarifies That His Post About Testing Positive For COVID-19 Was For April Fool's Day + Posts Apology | Soompi

Updated April 1 KST: JYJ's Kim Jaejoong has now posted an apology letter on his Instagram after falsely announcing that he had COVID-19 on April Fool's

www.soompi.com

2Z’s Hyunwoong criticized after sampling George Floyd audio, apologies issued - Asian Junkie

Rookie group 2Z made waves internationally by being one of the initial artists to speak up in suppor

www.asianjunkie.com

 

[seungfloral]

yeah it's true, 2020 was wild....

Update: JYJ's Kim Jaejoong Clarifies That His Post About Testing Positive For COVID-19 Was For April Fool's Day + Posts Apology | Soompi

Updated April 1 KST: JYJ's Kim Jaejoong has now posted an apology letter on his Instagram after falsely announcing that he had COVID-19 on April Fool's

www.soompi.com

2Z’s Hyunwoong criticized after sampling George Floyd audio, apologies issued - Asian Junkie

Rookie group 2Z made waves internationally by being one of the initial artists to speak up in suppor

www.asianjunkie.com

These news honestly make me feel like a simulation !