Suga Controversy (1 Viewer)

[VillageIdiot]

The opening samples a speech from Jim Jones. Jonestown massacre Jim Jones. Armys, in typical kpopper fashion, either half-ass condemned him or bent over backwards to defend him. (And got trending with BLM which caused a mess since most of the victims were black:poutsica:)
But it has sparked interesting takes.
Apparently Jim Jones was a staunch North Korean supporter and Anti-SKor, so Suga was disavowing it (Edit: kinda-not-really)
And it's okay to sample it so long as you incorporate it into the piece well

What do you think?

Edit: it appears karmy are dragging him too and don't want ifans defending him

 

[VillageIdiot]

Also low-key thank Corona for letting finish his mixtape
Yikes all around :poutsica:

 

[Abeamus]

I saw the take that rappers do it all the time but I think there were better ways to get across that message than bringing up this kind of history since Army no doubt has kids in it and the last thing i'd want to do is get a kid to become twisted by coming across one of Jones speeches

 

[blueberries]

I think artistic freedom is important and to get inspired by real life events too. Lot of good art pieces have been inspired by tragedies and even bad people. But if you take sth so sensitive, you should be quite careful how you use it and what kind of thing you want to say about it.

For me I don't really notice from lyrics what Suga was trying to say for using that clip. Lyrics seem to be another braggy type lyrics aimed at haters, pretty much similar what BTS has already done with Mic Drop and Ddaeng already.

 

[Ashla_K]

I actually had to google about Jim Jones and he had the whole package: False preacher, religious radicalist, communist, authoritarian, slaver, abusive and murderer
Dear Lord...

 

[Belgizen]

I will write my feelings about this as being someone part of the True Crime Community (I'll refer to it as TCC as I'm used to) for a long time. I don't share my TCC side as often for reasons that'll become clear in my post.

What you need to know is that the TCC is usually a community of people who are interested in being educated in cases or we theorize about motives and possible ending in cold cases. Many of us have helped solve some cold cases that are open to the public. The main goal of the TCC is to spread awareness for certain crimes (especially missing people).

That being said, there is a negative stigma around the community. Lots of people see the TCC as those shooter fangirls. WE ARE NOT! We only educate ourselves around the case and then theorize about the motives of the shooter etc. The TCC always condones the actions of the shooter or murderer. Whilst there is a part of "groupies" in the TCC, majority of us aren't and we don't idolize them. There are also people who think that we are disrespectful. WE ARE NOT! We are very respectful when it comes to talking about the victims or posting pictures of the victims (or their body, yes). We don't go around on the dark web or something to look for gory pictures of the body. We do look at pictures of bodies, as police usually releases them when it's a cold case, as "internet sleuths" have proven their worth.

With that being out of the way, it's clear from my paragraph that we fight against a lot of stereotypes surrounding us. The Jonestown massacre is a very well known case and is a case that newbies in the TCC often explore. So this case is nothing new for me and we know it inside-out. I haven't seen posts on this issue by my fellow TC-members so I can only show my personal opinion about this.

This really disappoints me. People should not excuse him, even if Jim Jones had something against SK and he is "shading" him. Speeches of people like these shouldn't be used for an aesthetic or a song, even if you're "bashing" them. It is still disrespectful towards the victims and their families who tried to get them home. It's quite frustrating that we, the TCC, are being viewed as direspectful beings but are working to better our reputation and move away from the Tumblr school shooter groupie-stigma, only to see people use it as an "aesthetic". Cuz that's what it is. As I mentioned before in another post, searching for the speech is very hard and there is a certain knowledge needed on the case to find it.

 

[RainbowDevil]

Well that was unnecessary... whether he researched it or a producer helped it with him... they either knew about it or if they didn't they should likely look more into it before making such things.

 

[Evergreen]

About the coronavirus issue : He never thanked coronavirus and never said that coronavirus is a blessing like some antis tried to say it. He was speaking about his mixtape and said that it’s a blessing. A whole context is lacking here.








About Jim Jones. I am uncomfortable about him using this sample and I think that he knows very well what he was doing. I am waiting for an explanation because the lyrics of the songs indicate that he uses this sample to criticize the part of the speech that he included in his song.

 

[dooh]

what phrase did he use from JJ ? still clueless

 

[Belgizen]

what phrase did he use from JJ ? still clueless

… though you are dead, yet you shall live, and he that liveth and believeth shall never die.

This is from Jones' sermon in 1977, Philadelphia

… faithful workers coming in night after night, giving me their heart, giving me the spirit of socialism.

Sermon from 1976, San Fransisco

 

[RainbowDevil]

This is from Jones' sermon in 1977, Philadelphia


Sermon from 1976, San Fransisco

I'm fascinated and creeped out by your knowledge I read your entire comment earlier tho so I understand

 

[xdreamsandflames]

This really disappoints me. People should not excuse him, even if Jim Jones had something against SK and he is "shading" him. Speeches of people like these shouldn't be used for an aesthetic or a song, even if you're "bashing" them. It is still disrespectful towards the victims and their families who tried to get them home. It's quite frustrating that we, the TCC, are being viewed as direspectful beings but are working to better our reputation and move away from the Tumblr school shooter groupie-stigma, only to see people use it as an "aesthetic". Cuz that's what it is. As I mentioned before in another post, searching for the speech is very hard and there is a certain knowledge needed on the case to find it.

i agree 100%, this is extremely disrespectful and shouldn't be excused or used in a song for the aesthetic. in the song itself, i agree with others about how there is no (or at least, i don't find any) direct shading or criticism of the speech, and even if there was then the speech shouldn't be in there to begin with. it's disrespectful to the victims and families as you said and is extremely insensitive in general. i hate that armys are trying to defend him on this somehow.

 

[Belgizen]

I'm fascinated and creeped out by your knowledge I read your entire comment earlier tho so I understand

I have seen a lot of things that scarred me tbh
Anyways I'm always free to share some cases or theories if you want
I myself am more of a Ripperologist so I know a lot of Ripper theories.
My main focus are older cases like JtR, but also the Hall-Mills murder etc

 

[Belgizen]

i agree 100%, this is extremely disrespectful and shouldn't be excused or used in a song for the aesthetic. in the song itself, i agree with others about how there is no (or at least, i don't find any) direct shading or criticism of the speech, and even if there was then the speech shouldn't be in there to begin with. it's disrespectful to the victims and families as you said and is extremely insensitive in general. i hate that armys are trying to defend him on this somehow.

Yes
He could've shaded him by referencing him.

 

[Evergreen]

And I also don’t like the fact that some ARMY are dismissing the problem by saying that it’s fake outrage. For some people it might be but all the people who were offended by the sample deserve an explanation. I understand why the sample is considered offensive. I am really uncomfortable myself and have now a weird feeling about What of you think ?

 

[Venomous]

Imma just leave this here...

 

[blueberries]

Imma just leave this here...

Is that legit translation? Cause, yikes.

 

[Venomous]

Is that legit translation? Cause, yikes.

Apparently so, it's from the same account currently trying to defend him.