Sensitive [tw: mentions abortion] Do you think governments should be able to control their population legally? (1 Viewer)

[mysteric]

very true but business is not really ethical. for example, finding loopholes into not paying your taxes. while it's legal, it's def not ethical.

true
but if it’s a lot harder for opposition to get people to loathe you when it’s about concepts foreign to them (I barely understand business tbh but I pick up a bit from misc sources), rather than concepts that directly affect them

 

[raymondchouku]

As poverty is a portion, I will respond to that. Policies can be implemented to reduce poverty, yes, but an overarching policy or policies to destroy poverty is not going to work. If you want society, that is increasingly based on consumerism [as we all enjoy even if we complain] then the idea of poverty must exist. Jobs that no one wants have to be filled: Cashiers, Garbage men, housekeepers, and so on...

Moving beyond that to the primary issue of population control. People who have less $$$ tend to have more kids based on many factors. People with more $$$ tend to have less children. And that isn't necessarily related to them having less kids. Consider this: Those who are poor tend to have higher rates of religiosity. Perhaps religiosity is related to being against abortions and other contraceptives. This relates fairly well to a greater number of kids. Go back to my grandfather who was raised in Ireland in the early 1900s where contraceptives were never an option. He was raised in a family of 10. . . I don't know the history of contraceptives to know if there were effective use of birth control then, but I do know practicing Roman Catholics are staunchly against the use of contraceptives. And that is another issue: How to you expect to limit children for these people? They are against condoms and abortion. If abortion becomes obligatory then you are imposing law on one's religious values; this is against the constitution. Plus, I wouldn't surprised if revolts started to occur.

Hell, I'm religious and agree with this we are MEANT to have a separation of church and state (at least here <.<)

Yeah, but lutheranism is sorta liberal isn't it though?.. lol. We'll as opposed to some of my birth religion who make organized church-sponsored petitions to force a non-catholic "church" out of the neighborhood

 

[mysteric]

The fact that there are so many men frightens me

I mean how are we going to raise the female population? We can't reward people for having girls because that's unethical on so many levels. The government can't really fully change social stigmas either.

I think most people prefer having girls these days in china though, less pressure on providing a house etc when they get married
this is purely anecdotal though, and reflects more metropolitan views

 

[Lovely_Cornchips]

Yeah, but lutheranism is sorta liberal isn't it though?.. lol. We'll as opposed to some of my birth religion who make organized church-sponsored petitions to force a non-catholic "church" out of the neighborhood

My take on Lutheranism is that it's much more open than other branches but there are still some assholes in it, that include pastors who preach hate and I can't deal with that shit at all. Like we are all God's children why you fucking hating on Albert because he loves a man!?!? You got an issue with love!?!?!

 

[Mayday]

As poverty is a portion, I will respond to that. Policies can be implemented to reduce poverty, yes, but an overarching policy or policies to destroy poverty is not going to work. If you want society, that is increasingly based on consumerism [as we all enjoy even if we complain] then the idea of poverty must exist. Jobs that no one wants have to be filled: Cashiers, Garbage men, housekeepers, and so on...

Moving beyond that to the primary issue of population control. People who have less $$$ tend to have more kids based on many factors. People with more $$$ tend to have less children. And that isn't necessarily related to them having less kids. Consider this: Those who are poor tend to have higher rates of religiosity. Perhaps religiosity is related to being against abortions and other contraceptives. This relates fairly well to a greater number of kids. Go back to my grandfather who was raised in Ireland in the early 1900s where contraceptives were never an option. He was raised in a family of 10. . . I don't know the history of contraceptives to know if there were effective use of birth control then, but I do know practicing Roman Catholics are staunchly against the use of contraceptives. And that is another issue: How to you expect to limit children for these people? They are against condoms and abortion. If abortion becomes obligatory then you are imposing law on one's religious values; this is against the constitution. Plus, I wouldn't surprised if revolts started to occur.


Yeah, but lutheranism is sorta liberal isn't it though?.. lol. We'll as opposed to some of my birth religion who make organized church-sponsored petitions to force a non-catholic "church" out of the neighborhood

Maybe the reason there are so many Roman Catholics is because they're against contraceptives.

I absolutely do not agree with forced abortions either. This entire subject is a really difficult one because there are so many different things to consider.

 

[Mayday]

I think most people prefer having girls these days in china though, less pressure on providing a house etc when they get married
this is purely anecdotal though, and reflects more metropolitan views

That might be helpful slightly in a few years, but China is still suffering rn unfortunately.

 

[Abeamus]

Yeah, unfortunately it's hard to know what is really gonna work and what isn't.

Well it'd be the only humane approach that I can think of however one downside would be in effect it'd likely end adoption which would lead to people who can't have kids of their own but want to raise kids not being able to have them

 

[Mayday]

true
but if it’s a lot harder for opposition to get people to loathe you when it’s about concepts foreign to them (I barely understand business tbh but I pick up a bit from misc sources), rather than concepts that directly affect them

business is basically make money do drugs become a tax evader

 

[raymondchouku]

Like we are all God's children why you fucking hating on Albert because he loves a man!?!? You got an issue with love!?!?!

And then there's the nuanced religious argument: I don't mind that Albert's gay. I just don't like him dating men...

 

[Lovely_Cornchips]

And then there's the nuanced religious argument: I don't mind that Albert's gay. I just don't like him dating men...

That is how most of my friends and parts of my family think (they all aren't lutheran but they all are conservative) which I'm glad they don't hate me or some shit for my sexuality but like also...like...why???

Not to mention the pastor I had growing up was super chill. He never preached hate towards those who are LGBT+ and I believe one of his sons was gay actually, but we got a new pastor who is so beyond hateful. My sister couldn't get married in her childhood church simply because she was living with her fiance and therefore barred from celebrating her love there-like what kind of fuckery is this!?!?!?

 

[Mayday]

And then there's the nuanced religious argument: I don't mind that Albert's gay. I just don't like him dating men...

A (not so) wise Kaitlin Bennett once said something along the lines of,

"I don't hate gay people. I just find them disgusting."

Actually, come to think of it, discouraging homophobia might actually decrease population growth.

 

[Lovely_Cornchips]

A (not so) wise Kaitlin Bennett once said something along the lines of,

"I don't hate gay people. I just find them disgusting."

Actually, come to think of it, discouraging homophobia might actually decrease population growth.

My cousins who are adopted hold the above belief they don't flat out say it's disgusting of course but they do say that they don't necessarily support it while not hating those who are gay. But more adoptions would occur if there wasn't this awful stigma or hatred towards gay couples, tHEY SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO ADOPT AFJBHSJFKDSVN

 

[Mayday]

My cousins who are adopted hold the above belief they don't flat out say it's disgusting of course but they do say that they don't necessarily support it while not hating those who are gay. But more adoptions would occur if there wasn't this awful stigma or hatred towards gay couples, tHEY SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO ADOPT AFJBHSJFKDSVN

I totally forgot adoptions were a think for a good hour. I should have included it in my stance smh. But yes, adoption plays a huge role in this!

 

[raymondchouku]

Not to mention the pastor I had growing up was super chill. He never preached hate towards those who are LGBT+ and I believe one of his sons was gay actually, but we got a new pastor who is so beyond hateful. My sister couldn't get married in her childhood church simply because she was living with her fiance and therefore barred from celebrating her love there-like what kind of fuckery is this!?!?!?

is it completely out of the question for you to find another church? But yeah. Same reason why if I were in a romantic relationship I would be going to the Independent Catholic Church in the next city that is LGBT friendly. Because no parish affiliated with Rome will accept same-sex relationships.

 

[raymondchouku]

My cousins who are adopted hold the above belief they don't flat out say it's disgusting of course but they do say that they don't necessarily support it while not hating those who are gay. But more adoptions would occur if there wasn't this awful stigma or hatred towards gay couples, tHEY SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO ADOPT AFJBHSJFKDSVN

I think there's a law in Tennessee that in certain contexts adoption agencies can refuse same-sex couples from adopting children, based on religious freedom.

 

[Lovely_Cornchips]

is it completely out of the question for you to find another church? But yeah. Same reason why if I were in a romantic relationship I would be going to the Independent Catholic Church in the next city that is LGBT friendly. Because no parish affiliated with Rome will accept same-sex relationships.

She already got married and our old pastor ran it for her. Bless his soul. They moved it to where the reception was going to be and the people there were more than happy to oblige.

 

[Lovely_Cornchips]

I think there's a law in Tennessee that in certain contexts adoption agencies can refuse same-sex couples from adopting children, based on religious freedom.

Is this like in the parameters of adopting outside of the country? Because I know some countries a hundred percent would not be ok adopting out a child to a couple that isn't straight.

 

[Mayday]

I think there's a law in Tennessee that in certain contexts adoption agencies can refuse same-sex couples from adopting children, based on religious freedom.

I may be incorrect, so do correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe this is legal all across the United States? Something about freedom of religion.

Reminds me of the Colorado Baking incident.

 

[Lovely_Cornchips]

I may be incorrect, so do correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe this is legal all across the United States? Something about freedom of religion.

Reminds me of the Colorado Baking incident.

It is. It's apart of the constitution most private businesses have a right to refuse services to people which I don't disagree with tbh but I don't necessarily agree with how people wield it either but freedom does come at a cost tbh.

Edited: To private businesses because I believe they are at least allowed this.

 

[VillageIdiot]

Even simple things like general, informative sexual education in schools and ready, affordable access to birth control will drastically bring down birth rates in some areas, as well as increase the standard of living of poor, predominantly minority lead regions. AKA the real reason Conservatives want to defund Planned Parenthood and ban women's clinics so badly.


Maybe economic benefits like tax credits or stipends for people with kids would bring up birth rates in a healthy way? I'm not completely sure but I've heard many countries except the USA already do something to that extent