So what happens to the existing groups of Queendom Puzzle participants? (1 Viewer)

[RandAlThor]

Scared in what sense?

That if they didn't debut them they would leave and someone else would.
You are never going to find another Jiyho who trains for a decade, or the snsd (7 of the 9 trained for ~7 years)/Seulgi 7 year plus kids. neither the parents nor the kids have the trust or patience.

its gonna be The wonyoungs yujin chaewon(all 3 in iz*one with less than a year although you could count that a master class training.) eunchae giselle ect year or so for the kids.
Also why 4th gen is dance heavy since it takes time or just luck for a great vocal, but as we can see with all these ive kids videos ect, they start dancing very early and can be competent as young teens.

Now i would expect girls like say Eunbi who bounce around and finally make it but even Chaeyeon putting up with the CF that was RBW's buyout of WM surprised me. Stunned she did not do like Chaewon and asked to be let go. Good chance if she had she too would be in ssera.

 

[Moguri]

Not as common for 2nd gen. Some for 3rd gen (like those you posted, except for Taemin). But now, they all do (pretty much). All I'm saying is, as long as they protect them and avoid promoting them as grown ups! I've got a serious problem with 14 yr olds singing "don't u wanna, don't u wanna" or showing up on stage with tights on and push-up bras! That's all I'm saying. If its music in good taste with a teen-like choreo and decent apparatus, then its all good. But some of those agencies are crossing the line at times and it worries me to no extent because kids don't know any better and they end up striving for the dark side of the limelights, unbeknownst to what the industry is labeling them as!

Ok! It would still be interesting to see a graph how the average debut age changed over the years, but I'm not sure anyone made something like that. I just learned for example all members of Fifty Fitfy were at least 18 at debut! But its hard to find other examples for that, as most groups Maknae is a lot younger than the rest. On a positive note, Le Sserafim re-debuted Sakura who was already 24 at that time.

Regarding how the minors are presented.. from what I saw, this was also a big issue in the past, in Kpop and also in the west (or probably any music market where minors are involved).. I hope the companies can improve in that regard.. but its hard to have any trust in them

 

[RandAlThor]

Ok! It would still be interesting to see a graph how the average debut age changed over the years, but I'm not sure anyone made something like that. I just learned for example all members of Fifty Fitfy were at least 18 at debut! But its hard to find other examples for that, as most groups Maknae is a lot younger than the rest. On a positive note, Le Sserafim re-debuted Sakura who was already 24 at that time.

Regarding how the minors are presented.. from what I saw, this was also a big issue in the past, in Kpop and also in the west (or probably any music market where minors are involved).. I hope the companies can improve in that regard.. but its hard to have any trust in them

And Yujin from Kep1er was 26, Eunbi was 23, Irene was 23, but just that we know them shows how special/rare they are. each brought very specific assets to the teams.
All of RV was 18 + ( well Joy was a month shy at debut[they waited to add Yeri at her 16th birthday]) and they have always been called old.
MMM was all 18 +
maybe BP i have no idea.
Its a fine line, because at the end of the day the demo for pop music is typically 12- 19 with a next level to 26 ish. call it thru university unless they become serious fans of a group.

 

[Moguri]

That if they didn't debut them they would leave and someone else would.
You are never going to find another Jiyho who trains for a decade, or the snsd (7 of the 9 trained for ~7 years)/Seulgi 7 year plus kids. neither the parents nor the kids have the trust or patience.

its gonna be The wonyoungs yujin chaewon(all 3 in iz*one with less than a year although you could count that a master class training.) eunchae giselle ect year or so for the kids.
Also why 4th gen is dance heavy since it takes time or just luck for a great vocal, but as we can see with all these ive kids videos ect, they start dancing very early and can be competent as young teens.

Now i would expect girls like say Eunbi who bounce around and finally make it but even Chaeyeon putting up with the CF that was RBW's buyout of WM surprised me. Stunned she did not do like Chaewon and asked to be let go. Good chance if she had she too would be in ssera.

I don't think its fair to compare idols post IZ*One with trainees that have never debuted before. Jihyo was still young when she debuted though, like 18? I think its rather unsual that people start training so early, so I'm not sure if its still possible today, but 10 years was always an outlier. Wasn't it said that YG had a bunch of idols traininig for up to 10 years before Babymon debut and then just wasted everyones time and hopes..?

Oh I have no idea what Chaeyeon did, also maybe it was not her decision to make? I can imagine HYBE wanting Chaewon and offered money to get her out of her contract and maybe had no intentions to do the same for Chaeyeon? But this is pure speculation on my part.

 

[Moguri]

And Yujin from Kep1er was 26, Eunbi was 23, Irene was 23, but just that we know them shows how special/rare they are. each brought very specific assets to the teams.

And apart from Irene, everyone was involved wiht the Survival Show its the most common way for older idols to debut, I think Sakura is an outlier here, as she went from the survival show group and managed to re-debut again in a normal group

 

[Ahsoka]

tbh I wonder if this is really true or if the precption just changed, I tried to look up a few groups and it seems there always have been examples of 14-15 year old teens debuting in all generations

Here a few I could find:
SHINee Taemin 14 years
BTS Jungkook 15 years
Weekly Zoa 15 Years
fromis_9 Jiheon 14 years
Loona Yeojin 15 years

Lets not forget Boa with 13 years and the 2 examples from SNSD Rand already added.

I feel like in the grand scheme of things not much has changed, but people focus more on it now

And Zelo Gotta rep my boys.
I don’t know for sure but despite the young aged idols always being a thing I don’t know if the average age is going to be the same. I get the impression that countries debut a lot of idols from 14-17 years, so even if the age of the maknae stays the same the average age could be lower. But I’m not in the mood to calculate the average age of a bunch of kpop groups so idk

 

[Moguri]

All of RV was 18 + ( well Joy was a month shy at debut[they waited to add Yeri at her 16th birthday]) and they have always been called old.
MMM was all 18 +
maybe BP i have no idea.
Its a fine line, because at the end of the day the demo for pop music is typically 12- 19 with a next level to 26 ish. call it thru university unless they become serious fans of a group.

oh just saw you added 2 more paragraphs, you are always so sneaky

If we treat RV as a 4 member group in your example, its actually interesting, as yes BP is anotehr 4 member group where all members where 18+. The same goes for Aespa btw. Seems like the groups with a smaller amount of members are more likely to to not have a young maknae for some reason?

And yeah ofc I understand the reason why they do it... at least from how I understand it, the younger the Maknae is, the more they hope to connect with even younger demographics and increase the fanbase that way..

 

[Moguri]

And Zelo Gotta rep my boys.
I don’t know for sure but despite the young aged idols always being a thing I don’t know if the average age is going to be the same. I get the impression that countries debut a lot of idols from 14-17 years, so even if the age of the maknae stays the same the average age could be lower. But I’m not in the mood to calculate the average age of a bunch of kpop groups so idk

oh okay, so I add B.A.P Zelo 15 years to the list

If you you ever are in the mood to do those calcuations, please do it!

 

[Ahsoka]

oh okay, so I add B.A.P Zelo 15 years to the list

If you you ever are in the mood to do those calcuations, please do it!

Maybe it would be feasible if the number of groups debuting stayed similar. With the boom in 3rd and 4th gen that’s a whole lot of idols

 

[Moguri]

Maybe it would be feasible if the number of groups debuting stayed similar. With the boom in 3rd and 4th gen that’s a whole lot of idols

yep.... I would also not want to do it, also its hard to even get that information

I found this super helpful site, but they do not have all groups sadly, seems like they are working on it though:

K-Pop Members Age and Debut Age Lists

K-Pop Members Age and Debut Age Lists

dbkpop.com

 

[Ahsoka]

yep.... I would also not want to do it, also its hard to even get that information

I found this super helpful site, but they do not have all groups sadly, seems like they are working on it though:

K-Pop Members Age and Debut Age Lists

K-Pop Members Age and Debut Age Lists

dbkpop.com

I mean it’s okay if you want the most popular 3rd gen, most of the semi popular 4th gen, and throw in a random Shinee (but without Jonghyun for some reason). I can’t remember any 1st gen or any other 2nd gen.

 

[Moguri]

I mean it’s okay if you want the most popular 3rd gen, most of the semi popular 4th gen, and throw in a random Shinee (but without Jonghyun for some reason). I can’t remember any 1st gen or any other 2nd gen.

oh.. yeah I'm not sure whats up with that, for Gfriend half the group is missing too

 

[Ahsoka]

oh.. yeah I'm not sure whats up with that, for Gfriend half the group is missing too

I guess they ignore members who left or have passed away. Not super sure why